Morgan +8 Forum

It is cool here in Seattle. Cloudy 63 degrees. Not raining but I can see squalls working over Puget Sound.

Button

Hi,
Do you mean all is OK with your MSD now?
BR.
Daniel.

I don't think so. Just went for a test drive in the neighborhood. I have spent the last couple of days working on the Dizzy and timing. I had issues with this that I think I have now cured. But, although the +8 ran, it still was slightly balky at places where I would expect it to be smooth. Out of a scale of 10 it was about an 8. I need to get the Handheld Controller into the cockpit so I can monitor the MSD TBI while a drive it. I did check the Rover alternator out and it is a 100 AMP unit.

Not a cloud in the sky and 97F..but cooler lakeside with a steady breeze. Our friend Win is driving up from Montreal tomorrow (where he is visiting family) for lunch and an introduction to R9459. Looking forward to it. It will be the first time a meeting him face-to-face in 20 years.

Two hours 'til trout time. (so far this summer, Audrey is beating me 12 kilos ([aka 14 splake] to 2). I am going to switch lures when she isn't looking.

L.

Just took another test drive. Now Hand Controller is in the cockpit. Performed worse than the first time. Balky, idle is not good and engine quit, at key times in the traffic, unexpectedly. Nothing on the Hand Controller. I am stumped for the moment. But not driveable as is.

Button

Interesting adventure.

At the moment I do not think the problem is the MSD TBI. Rather, something is wrong with My installation. I am not the best Mechanic in the World, for sure!

Button

But one of the more pugnacious. You'll fix rapidly this trouble. Congratulations and good luck.

I now have the MSD TBI operational. Albeit with Standard Ignition system not the Timing supplied by the MSD unit. Idle good and runs at speed good. About the same as My Edelbrock Carb that was jetted by D&D Fabrication. So far I think a waste of money. However watch this space as I learn more about it. When I buy a MSD Dizzy and convert to MSD Timing their might be a different story.

Button

That it runs about as well as a custom jetted carburetor is not a surprise (especially with the goofy, unusual intake you are using). No performance gains were to be had other than an improvement in fuel economy (this will likely become evident once you start driving it longer distances). Economy will further improve once you have TBI control of the ignition timing.

With your TBI, it should run better at altitude. Remember, that was the point of the whole installation.

You did the right thing. Your results are encouraging.
It is on my list of stuff to do, after the scuttle hoop and headers sitting on the shop floor are installed.
I will be using an extrude honed (smoothed interior, straightened runners and matched ports) Buick 4bbl intake to maintain bonnet clearance with the large diameter K&N filter.

I was to take a trip up North to day. Seattle traffic was terrible (I live in the South West corner) as well 90 degree heat. I did take a fast run on a highway near My home and drove hill in back of My home which has about 1 mile incline. Not too steep and not too flat. Jan gave Me some advice last night that worked for the idle. I made the statement that the Carb is just as good as the TBI. Well I think I was comparing Apples and Oranges. The carb is 2 dimensional and the TBI is 3 dimensional. The TBI adds barometric pressure to the mix. The TBI also does what the Carb does but differently. Also the TBI iterates in a manner that keeps it going at close to 100% as possible. The carb does the same but it is mechanical and must be "tuned" to operate even close to 100%. Emissions is another difference which I am ignoring at the moment.

On the hill I quickly shifted in 4th and accelerated as fast as I could to the top of the hill. It was a steady pull. No balking. Not sure My speed at the top but it was over the 30 MPH city speed limit.

When I got to the hiway, It also starts as a long hill. Again I shifted into 4th as fast as I could and pulled the hill. The speed limit is 60MPH I went to 70 and backed off to 60. I was still going up a hill that was not very steep but hill never the less. It was again a smooth linear acceleration and I am sure I would be able to reach a 100 very soon if I did not back off.

Now comparing to carb, I must remember how the carb performed. Suffice to say the TBI did a beautiful job and as I get used to it I am sure I will be happy I bought it and installed it.

Also I am half way there. I still must get a MSD Dizzy and convert the system so that the TBI handles the timing.

Button

Excellent progress.

The hardest part of doing this installation is to get a proper setup. In reality , the is not any different than a carburetor.
Vacuum leaks, wiring and proper linkage adjustments are all part of the installation, just as it is with a carburetor.
The main difference is that when you have everything installed, you need to make your adjustments using the hand controller, and it is important to let the system work.

One of the problems noted in some installations was the puddling of fuel on the throttle plates. This was noted on the TBI forums, but not really addressed with a solution.

This is not unusual when just about 100% of the users don't really have any fuel injection experience, and limited carburetor setup knowledge. The problem of lack of experience appears to be universal...

The fix was to change one of the mechanical settings slightly (screwdriver), and one of the program settings to raise the idle slightly and get a good reaction from the IAC.

If you had a carburetor, the changes would be done by opening up the carb and changing hardware, by trial and error.

With the TBI, the changes are done using the hand controller. No parts required. But there is a little learning curve. With Button, we have a new library of knowledge should anyone decide to go with this system.

When Button moves to the automated ignition advance system, the full advantage of the TBI will become evident. With automated advance, it is likely that there will be a power increase, and an improvement in fuel economy in cruise (the result of additional advance).

Thanks Jan for talking Me thru this maze.

Button

It's FUN! And, you are pretty good at this. It's quite a change from a carburetor, and you were not intimidated. A lot of guys would give up as they didn't understand what the real (and relatively simple) problems were.
Hell, it is even working well with that dual port manifold. I don't think that you need to replace it. 'Might be the best setup.

Enjoy driving it. And, we want to hear about the computer controlled advance setup.

I wish I was there to drive it.

Being cheap I can't spend $340 for a MSD Dizzy and then lockup the advance system. So I ordered the HEI reluctor and magnetic giz wiz from Summit for about $50US. I will attempt to install this into My Delco Dizzy and see if I can save a buck. I suspect I will spend more and get less. But I must try.

Button